Scaling Your Client Gifts, with Kris Rudeegraap [Episode 749]

Kris Rudeegraap, CEO and Co-Founder of Sendoso, joins me again in this episode.

Key Takeaways

  • Sendoso sends digital and physical gifts for B2B sales, marketing, and customer success teams. Kris Rudeegraap and Braydan Young left jobs as account executives and co-founded Sendoso (originally CoffeeSender) in 2016.
  • CoffeeSender began by sending Starbucks gift cards. CoffeeSender expanded their gifts to a great variety of items and became Sendoso. Kris comments on how their company grew.
  • Kris explains the use cases he sees most often and how Sendoso is being used with TalkDesk, Outreach, and Salesforce.
  • Sendoso has gifts from about 500 merchants, including e-gifts, consumables, and hard goods. Sendoso also works with Amazon. Kris explains. Sendoso can include hand-written notes. Sendoso also inventories gifts.
  • Kris discusses the various categories and their popularity. About 50% are warehoused and print-on-demand items. The other 50% of sales are split about evenly between E-gifts and consumables. The staff does the taste tests.
  • Kris reveals the back-end of Sendoso: five warehouses around the world plus drop-ship partners for perishable and consumable goods. Sendoso built the software to run their infrastructure and a front-end Sendoso app.
  • Kris tells how Sendoso can be used in demand-generation marketing, situational gifting after a demo or to get a meeting, and for customer success. HR can use it for employee-to-employee sending.
  • Certain industries impose limitations on gifts and Sendoso tracks orders to work within compliance guidelines and validation rules.
  • Kris discusses ROI. Sendoso is scalable, compared to using in-house resources. Direct mail converts better than other channels; Kris’s customers are seeing success with gifts. Sendoso suggests gifts according to account needs.
  • What kinds of sales representatives get the best results from gifting? Kris shares some observations. Sendoso is putting together a data trends report.
  • Sendoso just raised $40 million in Series B Financing. They’re hiring across the board and investing resources into R&D. Kris shares his vision of growth for the next two years.
  • Unlike email, gift-sending has a cost, so market saturation is unlikely. Kris talks about personalization.

Episode Transcript

Andy Paul

Hey friends, I have another excellent episode lined up for you today. Joining me as my guest this week is Kris Rudeegraap. Kris is the co-founder and CEO of Sendoso. If you’re not familiar with them, they enable B2B sales, marketing, and customer success teams to send both digital and physical gifts to buyers and customers. This is a cool and innovative concept for building a deeper, more personal connection with your buyers. If you’re not familiar with how gifting works, then you’ll want to make sure you stick around to check out our conversation here today, we’re gonna dive into the use cases for gifting that Sendoso sees most often, we’ll talk about how it’s being used by some of our customers like TalkDesk and salesforce.com. And we’ll talk about how to send-as-a-service can also be used for demand generation marketing. It’s situational gifting, maybe you just are given a demo, or even to get a meeting with someone that you’ve been trying to breakthrough. Gatekeepers and gifting can be a very powerful way to do that. I mean, it’s really useful for Customer Success teams to deepen connections, build relationships, basically the only limit on how you use gifting is your imagination. So we’ll be getting into all that and much, much more. So let’s jump into it, Kris. Welcome!

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Thank you so much, Andy.

 

Andy Paul  

So, for those who aren’t familiar, we’re going to give you a chance to give a little background about Sendoso. So first, and then we’ll give you a chance to talk about your big news, which just happened today. So for people who aren’t familiar, tell us about Sendoso.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

So Sendoso. We incorporate digital and physical sending strategies into sales, marketing, and customer success programs. So basically, you know, direct mail and corporate gifting, but integrated and at scale.

 

Andy Paul  

And is it when you say corporate, I mean, you’re talking about one to one type thing, though, right? On a person to person level.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yes, but it’s not like for you. It’s meant for businesses. So you’re not going to come on here and send your wife a gift or anything. But yeah, but for businesses to use to engage with their customers or prospects or employees.

 

Andy Paul  

So you guys have been in the business for about three years now, three years because I spoke with you and your co-founder back then when the two of you were sharing a desk. What was the impetus to start the company? What would you see out there? 

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

So me and my co-founder, Brandon, we both have sales backgrounds. We’re both account executives before starting the company. And kind of two things happened. One at the last company, I was at the TalkDesk, I saw the evolution of email, and seeing that, you know, people are sending more and more millions of emails and that digital saturation. And so as a creative salesperson, I began, you know, writing handwritten notes, I’d go and grab swag out of the closet and send it. I would go to Starbucks and buy gift cards and send those and was doing a ton of these like creative ways to kind of breakthrough that noise, right? It was working well. And so kind of the first thing I thought, hey, why isn’t there an easier tool to send out Starbucks gift cards inside of Salesforce? And so that was very palatable in terms of, Hey, I can start that. So I found a few engineers and put together some mock-ups and came up with the concept of the coffee sender. Which was exactly what it was. Sending some Starbucks gift cards out through Salesforce. That was the original name of the company, about probably three and a half years ago. Launching that is really like self-service, kind of a simple feature, I would say, not necessarily a platform, but it was good.

 

Andy Paul  

You had the vision of doing something bigger?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Correct. We had the vision of doing something bigger. This was just like the easiest thing we could bite off day zero. And then, once that happened, we started to probably, were sending hundreds of thousands of Starbucks cards and got to a point where we’re ready to morph into Sendoso.

 

Andy Paul  

Okay, so let’s just go back to the coffee cards for a second. So who was using those and how are they using it? And was it at the time I recall is more about sort of, maybe SDRs using it as a way to get that book that demo or something like that. But once you tell us about that,

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so as I was, you know, SDRs, AE, some CSM, really things around booking demos, thank yous, reminders to attend meetings. King of one off the things. We had a few people using it for, like webinar incentives or, you know, other miscellaneous kinds of relationship-building initiatives. So that was kind of the original use case

 

Andy Paul  

And did managers at that time – because we’re gonna come back to this question later – did managers have to set up the budget for their SDR at ease? Or was there an approval process? Or typically did they say, okay, you gotta open reign, go spend, you know, 10 bucks per prospect?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

It was a little loosey-goosey where you could kind of just sign up and do whatever you wanted. And the first version was, there was no team, it was just like the one you one single user could use. So it was not necessarily built for the enterprise yet. It was built for the individual.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah. Okay. So that then started morphing and I remember some very interesting things. I love that idea because, yeah, obviously we’ve talked before, I’m a huge believer in keeping the human front center and sales. And this is sort of an interesting way to create that personal touch but also automate it to some degree.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Exactly. Yeah. So we were getting a ton of feedback and asking, “What else can we send through the coffee sender?” And at that time too, while I was at TalkDesk where I was before, the marketing team there was testing out direct mail, but it was something that I was manually doing. We then shifted to spreadsheets to try to copy and paste data. And so I saw the kind of twofold both from the coffee center and then at a, you know, enterprise company trying to do any kind of direct mail at scale, that it was a broken process. And so went back in, quit TalkDesk to build out Sendoso and all the warehouse infrastructure and the new software platform and spent about nine months kind of, you know, building out the infrastructure and working with engineers non-stop and doing no sales and marketing efforts, but just engineering and product.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah. So, we’re gonna get to the back end in a bit because I think that’s interesting, but I’m interested in how now people are sort of fitting in this into their cadences or their campaigns. And sort of the actual use case. So for you to get a new customer, for Sendoso, is that gonna be driven by the sales rep now or you’ve got a sales team, you’re outreaching out to sales managers, sales leaders, who are you selling to?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so primarily, we’ve been selling into sales leaders and marketing leaders, and some Customer Success leaders now too. But marketing has historically held the purse strings and also kind of the creative and was kind of the bottleneck for doing any kind of direct mail or gifts. Hmm. Now with our sending platform, we’re seeing that with Sendoso, marketing could still be involved, but it’s a much tighter alignment. And so marketing can enable the SDRs to ease the account managers, to have monthly budgets, to have certain things that they can send based on some validation rules, and then kind of give them the ability to use it in their ways.

 

Andy Paul  

And is that how you’re seeing it used mostly? Are reps sort of making that decision themselves whether it’s an SDR and AE? Or is there still like rules that companies are establishing saying, hey, as an SDR, you’ve got this budget by showing us these cases or, you know, somebody at this stage or how’s that working? Typically?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so definitely the SDR use case is huge. And we see that people are integrating it into Outreach and SalesLoft so that they can be more programmatic in terms of like step two, you send this, step eight, you send this so there’s that. In addition to that with the monthly budgets, there’s also some like validation rules that we can connect through Salesforce. So like, you can as the manager or admin say, if this person is not in stage three, you can’t send the champagne or if this person isn’t in the finance industry, then you can’t send the finance case study printed clip kind of thing. So there is some of that data validation. To make sure that, you know, someone doesn’t go rogue and send the wrong thing, but the beauty is that this is another tool that you know sales can then use in addition to their emailing and their phone calling and their social media. And it’s just another way to communicate and build a more human rapport with prospects and customers.

 

Andy Paul  

So let’s look at sort of the breakdown of the gifting types, if you will, that exists. I mean, I imagine you still have Starbuck cards.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Expanded we’ve got about 500 other merchants now.

 

Andy Paul  

So as you said, expensive bottles of champagne. You know, you’ve got some clever gifts around. Yeah. Locking bottles of champagne or wine or something, and for the prospect to contact you to get the key. Tell us about some of those.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so we kind of look at it in a few different buckets. So one is we have the gifts that you just mentioned, so we have more perishables. So these would be like your cupcakes and your flowers and, and other things like that. The third is like art. Infinite inventory integration through Amazon. So this is where you can think of the recipient’s interests such as maybe their alma mater, or a sports team memorabilia or something hobby related or life event. And then through our integration, there’s a button in Amazon that says buy us and so pops out of Salesforce, select the contact, then that package is sent to send us that warehouse, we unbox it, add a handwritten note, Reebok it and ship it out on track through Salesforce. So it looks very personalized, too. But we can have, you know, the 500 million skus that Amazon has at our disposal.

 

Andy Paul  

And the handwritten note that’s based on a handwriting sample somebody’s given before.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, we have hand writers at our facilities that will do some handwriting, that will write out everything on behalf of our customers.

 

Andy Paul  

Very cool. Yeah. So yeah, I’ve always always been fascinated by that. 

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Then the last thing is just like our typical inventory in kind of products, which could be promotional products and corporate swag or could be one-off gifts. You know we’ve done some cool things like Lego Minifigures that look like the prospect. We’ve done these cool decoder glasses, we did this national Dog Day dog toys, there are custom options. There’s one cool coming up for Valentine’s Day, which is those candy hearts. You know, there’s one fairly sure we customized them with some messaging and a logo. And those are going to be sent out. So those are kind of like fun, like, you know, good timing to send those out.

 

Andy Paul  

And so you talked about swag. So from a corporate staff swag standpoint is the company you’ll warehouse for a company will be like their store their warehouse and-

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Exactly, it’s okay. Yeah, yeah. And we do all the sourcing too. So that was another headache in the process because there are physical goods and you want to have four different items and a custom box that might be for different vendors. We have, you know, thousands of vendors in our preferred vendor network around the world, where we’re constantly sourcing and buying and procuring things On our customer’s behalf.

 

Andy Paul  

So, you know, among those sort of three buckets of you know, the digital gifts, the consumables, let’s say, and the bottles of wine or swag or whatever, how’s it sort of breakout in terms of what percentages are you seeing it? Or this is the most, you know, popular category if you will, and what are you seeing in terms of what your customer is seeing relative to what works best?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so I would say, we, you know, we see probably around 50% is kind of the warehouse inventory items that are kind of a catch-all for everything to the warehouse, probably about 10%. 

 

Andy Paul  

And that could be the Amazon things and so on. Right?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, it could be, you know, corporate swag, it could be printed on-demand collateral or printed items. So that’s kind of a catch-all for anything. 

 

Andy Paul  

And so those are printed on demand? Have they been personalized?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Correct? Yeah. So this could be Like a print on demand booklet that’s personalized with the recipient’s name or logo or things like that. So that’s about half of that. I’d say about a quarter is E-gifts and another quarter is the consumables.

 

Andy Paul  

So yeah, I just remember when Braden was talking about a couple of years ago, we were talking about this, are you saying that you could send a cookie to somebody that’s their LinkedIn profile picture.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, we’ve done this.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah, I think that’s, that’s personalized. I think that’s great. I just worry about the foods you have, like people going through tasting them to make sure they taste good.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

We have tons of food shipped to our office. So we are all taste testers. I think every day we have like a new treat or a new succulent to look at or things like that. It’s pretty fun.

 

Andy Paul  

Well, if you ever need a food taster let me know. I think I could do that. So talk about the back end then because it’s I think it’s something that that, you know, people are going to get involved in. The fascinating part about this is, as you said, virtually infinite what you can do. 

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah. So, you know, the back end is kind of composed of five warehouses around the world where we are sourcing, storing, and shipping things. So we cover California. We’ve got one in Las Vegas, Nevada, up in Canada, Australia, and the UK. So those are our, our regional facilities. We also, you know, have some dropship partners for things like perishables and consumables that will be delivered directly from the bakery. They don’t like every hit in our warehouse, right? But yeah, it’s pretty interesting. We have, we’ve built software to run all of the infrastructures. We’ve built software to kind of help. Have this front end, send out an app, and then we build all the software that integrates into another Salesforce is HubSpot. Marketo is outreach to sales ops to the world. So a lot of moving parts.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah. So why don’t I go through now that serves the actual usage going for the audience that’s listening is probably still thinking, Okay, well, how would I use this? Because it’s I said, it’s been used in so many ways. And I wonder is that are you finding on your statistics that it’s more effective as a part of a campaign or as a more effective serve a situational spur, the moment responding to the customer type, type approach?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

So I think it’s both so I think that we see like demand Gen marketers and marketing programs, running certain types of kind of air cover campaigns to certain groups or certain ABM, targeted lists

 

Andy Paul  

and are those primarily direct mail at that point.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

You know, I would say like the word direct mail and gifts, I think have been are kind of synonymous in my eyes and our sense of like, you know, some people will call it a direct mail or some people will call it a gift, right, you know,

 

Andy Paul  

so, but what you’re mailing is something physical, you’re not just mailing a digital rack, a digital ego.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yes, exactly. Right. Yes, yes. Yes, that’s a good clarification. And so there’s that then. And then there are situational things where it’s like having SDRs and AE’s can click and send it, whether it’s the second step in their sequence or whether they’ve just got off a demo or during deal acceleration. So it’s another tool that they can use on their discretion to move deals either to get a meeting or to move deals to close. And then on the other side of once the deal closes, you know, customer marketing is coming in and doing some customer marketing along with customer success having like, the availability to do real-time, you know, click a button for like other customer milestones or life events, right. So Those are the primary use cases. And then we’re seeing some cool carry on where like recruiters and HR teams are using it for an employee to employee sending. So we’re starting to see a little bit of carryover there, too.

 

Andy Paul  

So, are there limitations that your customers are finding? Because gifting can be a sensitive subject, especially, you know, when it comes to perceptions of I know, they’re not very expensive, but perceptions of trying to curry favor bribery or whatever. So there are certain industries in government you can’t do that. But what are you guys finding in that regard?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah. So I mean, certain industries will have certain limitations. I mean, like printed-on-demand collateral, or as a handwritten note, that’s not like a monetary gift. So we still see people that work with governments or with medicine, there’s like a sunshine act if you’re sending it to some doctor. The beauty of our platform is we make it very trackable. So from a compliance purpose. We help companies there, we also put those guidelines, which were like you try to send someone that has a medical industry, you can only send these things like maybe a handwritten note. So we have a lot of validation rules in place.

 

Andy Paul  

So how are you tracking then?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

It’s typically just based on Salesforce data. So it’s how is the Salesforce how their sales were set up, and how the admin wants to like, figure that. So could be si code could be another Salesforce field. Right? But so let’s answer your question. You know, different industries, actually would benefit from us better than if they didn’t have a policy in place or a tool so that, you know, maybe a salesperson doesn’t accidentally send something on their own and, you know, tracking and visibility. So we work across the different industries there. We also have things like, you know, the ability to donate something to charity, or other nonmonetary valued items, to suffice for people that might not want to send something Like a bottle of wine.

 

Andy Paul  

That’s an interesting idea. So somebody could say, look, I want to send something to the customer, but, hey, they need a gift, like they need a hold in the head, but I could make a charitable contribution in their name to something.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yep. Or you could send them a charity choice E gift where they can select that they’d like, you know, the ASPCA versus Red Cross kind of thing and let them kind of choose their charity kind of thing.

 

Andy Paul  

What are you seeing on redemption rates in terms of that?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Ah, I don’t know which charity off the top. My head is more. Pick more.

 

Andy Paul  

What do people typically do to redeem the charitable ones though?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Okay, that’s cool.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah, I think it’s one of those things people will get and they’ll just set aside and never do. So what are your customers telling you in terms of sort of ROI on this for them? Because Yeah, we’re trying to do it, we’re trying to accomplish certain different things right. One could just be getting a demo, one can be as part of your ABM campaign. Yeah, the playbook says at this stage, we send the champagne. What are you hearing?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so you know, there’s a couple of different ways that our customers look at ROI. One is just the ROI of having a scalable sending platform like Sendoso, versus kind of doing this ad hoc in house. So, you know, a lot of companies we work with will be doing some sort of this, like manually and having expensive employees, pack boxes, or try to coordinate sourcing and procurement and stuff. So there’s kind of an ROI and just a cost of execution, which we can save them money on. There’s the ROI of just direct mail in general. So direct mail converts is a channel better than almost any other channel, a ton of data, and case studies. Even our customers know that themselves. So they’re trying to figure out how they can do more of it. So it’s kind of with our platform, they can actually operationalize sending out direct mail and gifts and do it at scale that they want. So there’s you know, driving ROI that way.

 

Andy Paul  

So if they’re doing something at scale, so what type is that gift going to be ascending? Okay, we’ve got a campaign. This is a lead gen campaign-

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

When they say at scale, it’s more of like, yeah, they can rinse and repeat something on an ongoing basis. And it’s not like, you know, it’s something that they could set, you know, 5-10 things up in our platform and have those always on or have something that goes out to 10,000 people, 1000 people, whatever they want.

 

Andy Paul  

And does wine convert better than a T-shirt?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

There’s a lot of factors in it. So it’s hard-pressed to blanket certain items because there’s the message, there’s the timing, there’s what’s mentioned before and after. So rather than us giving kind of a blanket recommendation, like send socks or send wine, you know, we usually will look at the customer’s use case, and we’ll give them some guidance around “Hey, here’s based on your target audience and what you’re trying to accomplish in the use case. Here are a few things.” So it’s more of a curated suggestion. We provide some account strategy because you know, not all industries or personas or use cases are created equal?

 

Andy Paul  

Sure. And that guidance comes from your customer success team.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Exactly. Yep. So we have that. We also our customers, also see ROI in terms of just like the cost of goods. So we had to have like the economies of scale, Costco-model where we can buy things cheaper than you can. Once we pass along those, that value to our customers. So there’s that as well. And then, you know, one of the other things is just the ability to track direct mail and see the ROI. So, you know, without Sendoso, you’re kind of semi going rogue or people are just sending stuff willy nilly. With us, everything sent is tied to a Salesforce campaign or into Marketo or HubSpot, so you can trackback and you can see campaign attribution, you could see, you know, per direct mail send what pipeline is created or influenced. So you get that visibility that you’re never able to see before and if you tie that attribution into your, you know, attribution software, then you’re that much better.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah, so as I was thinking about this, in preparation for our call today is like, I was thinking, okay, I wonder if you were you better off giving gifting power to, you know, the top 10%? Because it’s always way more effective at them? Or does it provide incremental benefits? Because they’re gonna get that business anyway? And, you know, the real impact is maybe on the, you know, the middle class, if you will, who are, you know, struggling to achieve that, that they get that little boost? They might not have gotten otherwise? I mean, how do you see that sort of breaking out in your customers if you have that insight?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, I mean, I think we see that not as a difference in terms of here like a top performer versus like a lower performer in terms of like your 

 

Andy Paul  

budget. Yeah, budget, but does it help you right, because I’m thinking okay, at the top performers, Yeah, they’re gonna be top performers anyway, right? Whether they’re gifting or not, but does the gifting help them? But then I’d see it the next tier down. That’s, you know, the aspirational people. The strategic gifting helps them perhaps even more than it does the top people because it’s, you know, it’s a difference-maker for them. Just running again, if you’re seeing any evidence of that.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so I’d say across the board, gifting helps everybody, there’s no doubt about it, that this is just another kind of communication channel to build rapport break into an account, you know, cross-sell, upsell, all that good stuff. Right. We are putting together a pretty extensive data trends report. I will be looking into some of that very detail with our data science team. And so I’ll pass it along with one set of lives, you’ll probably geek out over some of those insights. I’m sure I would.

 

Andy Paul  

So I promised before we got to talk about your big news. Yes. So today, you had some big news that you announced. Once you share that with our listeners.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, we announced that we just raised a 40 million Series B.

 

Andy Paul  

Wow. Yeah. Thank you.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah. Yeah, it’s been an awesome three years and just scaling up the team and the company and everything else.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah. So you said you’re gonna go to Mexico with this money? Yeah. So, are there specific parts of the business that you’re gonna use the money for? I mean, got a huge infrastructure, five warehouses. That’s impressive. I would imagine you’re probably hiring people from Amazon.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so we’re hiring across the board, from logistics to sales, to marketing, to engineering to product design, to finance to eating or hiring for as you know, we’re growing fast. And then we’re investing a lot of resources back into our product and r&d, and, you know, focusing on building out the product even more.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah, so you’d mentioned before we start recording that one of the investors in this round is strategic investors, so World’s one of the world’s largest logistics companies.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so Prologic ventures, which is a $60 billion publicly traded warehousing company, their corporate development arm invested in this round. The round was led by oak h CFT. So there, they lead the round, we also have participation from Felix ventures, all of our existing investors. So, craft ventures, Signia, storm struck the stage to the capital, and then we had a handful of like angels also come in, so it was quite, quite awesome to kind of put together such an awesome round.

 

Andy Paul  

Alright, so, looking forward then so what do you see is sort of the two-year horizon for where gifting is going to evolve. Besides Grinches greater penetration across the board, but what do you see is as the future there

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so I think this, you know, be more, you know, Having a sending platform and be because just having things like a CRM or an email tool. So I think companies, we still see companies that, you know, look-see a demo and are just jaw dropped like, holy. You know, I can’t believe this exists, right. Like,

 

Andy Paul  

I think most people think that’s part of it.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah. Right. So we still, there’s a lot of people to educate about this. I think we’re also seeing a shift in terms of, you know, direct mail gifting was kind of sitting in marketing for so long now. It’s kind of breaking out with our platform. And I think we’ll see more salespeople bring this on or customer success, you know, cx teams, think about how they can incorporate this into their strategies, so kind of democratizing the ability to send stuff, so it’s not, so it’s easier to do so that people can think about strategies and then execute because a lot of people are creative. They want to build more human relationships, but there’s just such a manual component to what we do that it’s hard to want to do. yourself. Yeah. So we’ve taken that, taking that on us.

 

Andy Paul  

Alright, so the final question again, sir, looking forward is because, yeah, this is still given the penetration. This is still quite a differentiator, right. There’s in the grand scheme of things, it’s Yep, you guys are still, you know, barely an inch deep and penetration. But as you get more widespread as if you’re in the perspective of a salesperson say, okay, gosh, now today, everybody’s giving in that context. What can they do to stand out?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Sure. I mean, I think one of the things that will prevent oversaturation is that there is a cost to what this is, so it’s not like maybe emailing you can send a million emails for free. So people think about clicking send, it’s not something that they’re just closing their eyes and clicking send a million times. So I think that they’re I don’t foresee like a big oversaturation of this. I think people will get more creative. We’re rolling out additional data services so people can be more data-driven, making sure they have the right address and person’s interests. So I see more targeted, personalized gifts, you know, quality over quantity and thoughtfulness throughout the entire lifecycle from, you know, the first interaction to five years later, I see this as being a tool that people will use to stay in touch to build better relationships. Hmm. It just is so synonymous to kind of communication that you’ve had through email, maybe you know, with some DOS, so you’d send them something like something for their birthday, maybe instead of just, you know, an email or not even or forgetting about it or posting on their Facebook.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. Okay. Cool. Well, I agree. I just I from the beginning have been excited about this because yeah, it’s personalized and I and personalized, yeah, you’re gonna do some of it at scale, but I think ultimately to make it meaningful You have to think about the individual on the other end as an individual exactly and choose something that resonates for them. Yeah, you can blink at Digital gift cards but you know if you take a left level up that’s where I think the real power of it comes in for the thoughtful deliberate seller. This is an interesting tool to build that connection that stands out as a big believer in Stu Heinecke’s work. Yeah. Talk to Steve’s lunch. I’m sure you have cuz Yeah, this is right along his line. Well, Kris, it’s great talking to you again. 

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Likewise, Andy. 

 

Andy Paul  

And congratulations on your seriously that’s fantastic news. 

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Thanks Andy. It’s great to do the podcast.

 

Andy Paul  

Yeah, well, this will hit about two weeks after we’ve recorded today so it’ll still be fresh. Yeah, for people that want to find out more about Sendoso or connect with you or how should they do that?

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, so Sendoso.com you can go ahead and check out our website. Me personally, you can find me on Ling den or shoot me an email even when I’m at the press which is at Sentosa calm.

 

Andy Paul  

It’s good. You didn’t have to spell out your last name for that.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

I know

 

Andy Paul  

as you get bigger if you hire another Kris, you may have to do that. So but CEO privilege you can treat Yeah,

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

the original.

 

Andy Paul  

Alright Kris, great conversation. Thanks for coming on.

 

Kris Rudeegraap  

Yeah, thank you so much, Andy.